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UHD (4k) Blu-ray Discussion Thread


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As much as I really don't need a 4k copy of Stripes I guess I'm ordering the box for Social Network and S&S. UHD needs more Emma Thompson. 

 

Re: Ran, surely they can't scrub any more grain than they already did for the Blu-ray? Surely? Please?

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I always thought the colour timing was more questionable with the 4k restoration or RAN than anything else (for which I don't think Canal can be blamed as I don't think they were the ones who did it).

 

Hopefully we get a UK date for the Sony set soon. Vol1 came over a month later than the US release.

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A US retail listing for a 25th Anniversary edition of Scream has popped up with an October 12th release date. That's especially interesting if correct as not only would it mark the first title from the Miramax/Dimension library to be released to UHD, it would be the first indication that Paramount does indeed have the intention of remastering and releasing some of those films in 4k (they bought into a 49% share of the library in late 2019).

 

The English Patient turns 25 this year too and it would certainly be nice if Paramount remastered that one as well, but they might not see it as having sales potential (at least not on 4k disc).

 

The Adams Family (1991) also has an Oct 12 listing (also a Paramount release). I'd love that, but it'd be a shame if the magnificent sequel isn't released alongside it.

 

Both Scream and Adams Family have UPC codes so do seem legit.

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9 hours ago, kelley said:

Would love to see The English Patient get a big 4K update. 

 

It would. Paramount tend to favour action, sci-fi and horror on UHD disc with only the rarest of exceptions though unfortunately, so second best would be 4k iTunes and a Paramount Presents Blu-ray from a new master. The old Miramax disc had great extras  (carrying a chunk of supplements over from the Criterion laserdisc plus more) so there'd be nothing vital needed in that area.

 

There aren't many from the Miramax/Dimension catalogue that I could see them doing UHD discs for if they don't start to become a little more liberal about the genres they're willing to release. Pulp Fiction, Kill Bill vol1 and 2 would be obvious choices but may need Tarantino's (reluctant?) approval. The Crow would be wonderful. Fair chance they could do Gangs of New York maybe.

 

What's sad is Paramount seem to be reluctant to license titles from their own catalogue to third parties anymore, so there's slim chance of them even letting Criterion have Trainspotting for a new Blu-ray that the film so badly needs (and it would be nice to see Criterion handle that having done the old laserdisc). Cop Land badly need a remaster too and would be good in the hands of a boutique label.

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I finished by full re-watch of the Indy movies. Temple of Doom remains my absolute favorite. It's not the best /film/ in the set but I love the darker tone and how much it leans into the horror aspects of its theme. Its also Williams' best score, IMO. The Thugee sacrifice scene and accompanying music is just damned brilliant. Raiders and Last Crusade are obviously classics and I won't spend much time on them as they've been discussed to the death in the past. I just wanted to reiterate my undying love for Temple. It's often maligned as "lesser" Indiana Jones but f-that. It's superb.

 

I mean, come on....

 

 

Also, having given Kingdom of the Crystal Skull another spin - outside of the "nuke the fridge" moment early on, I really enjoy the first hour of the movie. The new color grading helps bring it in line with the previous movies to an extent and Harrison Ford is just a treat as soon as he puts that hat on. I like the visit to Area 51 and that action sequence along with the fantastic chase scene on the motorcycle with Mutt.

 

The movie just falls apart as it progresses though. Even with the color changes, so much of it still looks more "digital" and fake than the previous films. I've no idea why as I know a good bit of it was filmed on location but its so...ugly.  For all of the hate for Mutt, he's honestly the least of the films problems. Ray Winstone's character, Mack is an utter waste of space! I legit hated any time spent on the character and laughable attempt to have us give a shit about him in the end is downright insulting. The Skulls themselves are boring as shit as the core focus of the movie and there's absolutely no tension or stakes as the film builds to its finale. Not to mention how much the movie leans into nonsensical slapstick shit! The Tarzan stuff is obviously front of mind but then you get into the Marion tree slingshot my head hurt by that point. The ingredients are here for a good movie but the chefs truly fucked up the actual cooking on this one. Time has not been kind to it, IMO and I hope to god Indy 5 doesn't make the same mistakes.

 

 

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I like the tone of Temple of Doom just fine, and the score remains one of the most thematically dense Williams has ever written (practically everything has a unique theme). It's the racism that drags the film down. 

 

My US copy of the Indy set is in the UK according to the tracking so should be with me any day now. 

 

My copy of Kino's UHD of The Good the Bad and the Ugly showed up today. I'm looking forward to watching that.

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Swiss retail listings have appeared for Unbreakable and Who Framed Roger Rabbit for 9th of September and 30th of September respectively. Hopefully these prove accurate!  They have UPC codes (Roger Rabbit is 4k/HDR on Disney+/iTunes...etc, and the 4k/HDR remaster of Unbreakable is available on Disney+ via Star is several territories now).

 

 

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Nice. Mind you, even the current HD stream I was watching the other week has a fair few hilariously low-detail shots with optical transitions , so I’m not sure UHD is going to help it a lot without some work. 

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I don't think there's any getting around opticals really, whether it's effects related or optical printing of opening title credits. Some of the terrific Sony discs we've had are noticeably shaky during opening title sequences for understandable reasons. Universal made the decision to apply some added noise reduction in and around the optical transitions in The Sting, which I don't think was necessary personally, but I understood their thinking and it's not so bad as to detract from my enjoyment. There's almost always going to be a dip unless a substantial restoration can be done to scan the elements separately, or optical titles are re-done digitally but the costs, notably for effects opticals, would be quite obscene which is why it's not uncommon to see dips in quality here and there. In Highlander's case, if budget constraints meant those opticals were hastily assembled to begin with then there's really not going to be much to redeem them (whereas Roger Rabbit, which is practically one giant optical effect, is a masterpiece of ILM's optical precision and, from what I skimmed of the D+ presentation last year, looks really great and I'm so happy that a disc appears to be on the way).

 

As usual now, it's the encode I'd be most worried about with Studio Canal doing Highlander. Eagle, an Italian label, actually did a better encode using Studio Canal's assets for Total Recall (Atto di Forza! as it's titled there). I keep meaning to make a point to import that version as I still haven't bought the Studio Canal disc, and apparently it also has the original 5.1 track which most seem to say is better than the Atmos mix on the Canal disc. It'd be interesting if something similar happens with Highlander if SC botch their own edition. Optical effects, smoke, Scottish fog.... It'd be a potential disaster of compression in the wrong hands I fear.

 

Again though, the Dolby Vision playback of these poor Studio Canal encodes does apparently fare better than the HDR-10 layer presentation. I'm still not entirely sure I understand why the DV metadata alters the compression artefacts but I'll be first to admit that there's still a lot about HDR, and indeed the various flavours of Dolby Vision, that STILL confuses me. 

 

I don't know what's happened between Studio Canal and Fidelity in Motion lately. Not that they had FiM do all their discs before, but they did hand them a good number of big titles in their catalogue (thankfully stuff like Elephant Man, Bill and Ted, Flash Gordon, Fifth Element and some others), but I think the last one they did was The Ladykillers which I still need to pick up. That was released back in November. I thought for sure that they'd hand them Total Recall, but sadly not. I still have this scenario in my mind where they do in fact re-issue T2 this year for its anniversary, and it finally has grain.... but ends up with a godawful encode. 

 

 

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The details for the 20th Anniversary screening of Mulholland Drive happening next month at Cannes reveals that Studio Canal are prepping a UHD release for Europe. Their Blu-ray release from a few years back was encoded by Fidelity in Motion and was a damn sight better than Criterion's, so it'd be a shame if FiM didn't do the UHD. This would be from the same 4k master created for the previous Blu-ray. 

 

https://www.festival-cannes.com/en/infos-communiques/communique/articles/the-2021-cannes-classics-selection

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7 hours ago, Angry the Clown said:

I'm still not entirely sure I understand why the DV metadata alters the compression artefacts but I'll be first to admit that there's still a lot about HDR, and indeed the various flavours of Dolby Vision, that STILL confuses me. 

 

I can't claim to be an expert either, but my understanding is that there are two flavors of Dolby Vision on UHD BD: MEL (minimum enhancement layer), which is meta-data, and FEL (full enhancement layer), which includes both meta-data as well as a 1080p "residual signal", and it's the recombining of the image with that residual signal / enhancement layer that winds up cleaner even when the base encode is a mess.

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1 hour ago, Adam Tyner said:

 

I can't claim to be an expert either, but my understanding is that there are two flavors of Dolby Vision on UHD BD: MEL (minimum enhancement layer), which is meta-data, and FEL (full enhancement layer), which includes both meta-data as well as a 1080p "residual signal", and it's the recombining of the image with that residual signal / enhancement layer that winds up cleaner even when the base encode is a mess.

 

I was definitely aware of MEL and FEL as that's why it was initially such a headache to rip Dolby Vision discs, and still continues to be an even bigger headache to find a device to play the files back properly if wanting to archive discs to a server (that plus there also being around half a dozen different 'profiles' of Dolby Vision to make matters even more confusing), but that's interesting that it's the 1080p aspect of the FEL that makes up the difference in compression. I think Paramount's saving Private Ryan disc suffered similarly to some of the bad Studio Canal stuff, where the DV holds up better compression wise than the HDR10, though I still find even the DV presentation on that disc to have anomalies.

 

When you really dig into Dolby Vision on disc it becomes easier to understand why Disney abandoned it. Their reasoning, at least as far as has been claimed, I believe was due to some players introducing "low latency" player lead Dolby Vision which added a new suite of problems into the mix resulting in inconsistent quality of presentation compared to letting the display do the Dolby Vision processing exclusively. At least with HDR10 they know where they are and that the UHD players will handle it in the exact same way (the way the display device will handle the tone mapping will still differ from brand to brand of course, but that's less of a headache than DV. Disney also only seem to master in HDR up to 1000 nits, so with good OLED displays being able to get into the 750nit region when calibrated, and good LED sets even being able to hit 1000 and even exceed it, I'd assume there's less chance that the tone mapping choices of LG, Sony...etc would struggle to display Disney's discs optimally anyway). 

 

I brought it up in the TV thread a while back, but interestingly the presence of low latency DV playback players turned out to be something beneficial for projector owners as an LLDV playback device combined with an HDFury Vertex box can create some trickery to pass the DV feed to a projector or a TV lacking dolby vision support like anything from Samsung, which presumably means people would be able to watch discs like those questionable Studio Canal releases with the reduced compression anomalies of the DV encode but on their HDR10 display. https://www.hdfury.eu/add-dv-support-to-any-hdr10-display/. I can't be completely sure but I want to say the only reason LLDV even exists was because of the deal Sony did with Dolby to adopt DV on their TVs, only Sony couldn't (wouldn't?) process DV internally on the chipset inside their displays which meant having to rely on it being done in the UHD player. It's only in the past year that Sony seem to have finally switched to full TV lead Dolby Vision like LG, Panasonic...etc provide. 

 

 

 

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16 minutes ago, Adam Tyner said:

 

James Flower tweeted a lengthy explanation why:

 

 

 

Epic thread. Good for him for going into so much detail. Pretty much confirms my assumptions posted in the Blu-ray thread about it (right down to the Fox factor indeed getting in the way of them being able to include the international cut). I wonder what "non-US label" he's throwing shade at with the A.I upscaling/fake HDR remark.

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2 minutes ago, Adam Tyner said:


That definitely caught my eye too!  Turbine, maybe? 

 

Could be. While I doubt he's claiming whatever label it is faked resolution and HDR for all of their releases, some of those discs coming out of Germany often struck me as being a little suspicious (the sheer volume of UHDs Turbine have been putting out does raise an eyebrow), and there has been some crossover with titles both Turbine and Arrow have released over the years, which could be how he might know that Turbine haven't been entirely honest with some of their discs. 

 

That he says "none of you noticed" makes me wonder if it's a more prominent label than Turbine though (or maybe I'm just out of touch with how many are importing Turbine's releases). The only prominent non US label I could think of would be Studio Canal but surely not? I know I knock them for some of their discs having poor compression, but they're a big enough company to wield the budgets to do proper scans and HDR masters. I can't possibly imagine it'd be Second Sight. 

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Arrow have had to drop the feature length documentary from the forthcoming release of Dune:

 

 

That's a damn shame. It might well prompt me to wait for a regular edition release now. I wonder if Lynch himself was a factor there. It's been said that he insists on approval on special features for all his films, but I wondered if that still extends to Dune given how little he cares for it. 

 

*edit* Doesn't seem Lynch related.

 

 

Why not just delay the release of the disc in which case?

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On 5/1/2021 at 10:29 PM, Angry the Clown said:

 

 

 

Fran Simeoni from Arrow has posted an updated (but still playfully cryptic) schedule for October through to March 2022

 

 

Most seem to be expecting 'DRUHD' in October to be Argento's Deep Red. I wondered if HUHD could be 'The Howling' but Studio Canal seem to have the rights to that in the UK (there is also actually a French retail listing for a UHD seemingly coming from them). Could it be Hellraiser? They did the trilogy on Blu here.

 

Also neither FUHD is Argento's Four Flies on Red Velvet, or The Frighteners (but he at least acknowledged the latter is still coming).

 

 

 

He also confirmed Naked Lunch and Last Emperor are still in the works. 

 

 

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