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The Official Television and Display Technology Thread - Enter of your own will.....(and leave with a lighter wallet)


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Aaand TV panel has been swapped.

So...l finally ended up making a decision on the TV. (Not really having much of a choice after the plasma started having screen issues).   I have decided to upgrade as much as possible. Star

Stop using the god damn out of box settings.... says Tom Cruise!    

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I've been mostly watching cable since purchase, I'll need to watch a few movies to see if I notice it there as well, the randomness makes it challenging to capture, I'm also on the latest firmware I can download from the set.

Can I ask what resolution you have the STB for cable set to out of curiosity?

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So here's a bit of fun. This website is apparently a decade old but it's a recent find to me. Displaywars gives you all the measurements you could wish for in comparing one display size to another. I absolutely love things like this. 

 

http://displaywars.com

 

50 vs 65"  B)

 

50-inch-16x9-vs-65-inch-16x9.png

 

http://displaywars.com/50-inch-16x9-vs-65-inch-16x9

 

 

50 vs 75"   :o

 

50-inch-16x9-vs-75-inch-16x9.png

 

http://displaywars.com/50-inch-16x9-vs-75-inch-16x9

 

When you compare the sizes you get a breakdown of not only the measurement differences between the displays, but also height differences and width differences for 1.33:1, 16:9 and 2.35:1 ratios as they would appear on either size, also image area percentage increases/decreases for the sizes you're comparing. So for example it tells you 1.33:1 content will occupy 53.11" of screen space on a 65" display vs 40.86" on a 50" screen. Really, really useful.

 

You can even conjure up a comparison between, for example, a 16:9 TV and a 2.35:1 projector/screen combo (50" TV vs 90" 2.35 in my custom comparison below):

 

50-inch-16x9-vs-90-inch-235x1.png

 

http://displaywars.com/50-inch-16x9-vs-90-inch-235x1

 

 

So, you can quickly calculate that if you wanted a projected 2.35 image at home that had the same screen area for 16:9 content as a 75" 16:9 TV you would need a 2.35:1 screen of 94".

 

75-inch-16x9-vs-94-inch-235x1.png

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Hmmm... Looks like we'll be getting HDMI 2.1 news a lot sooner than anticipated (tomorrow according to HDMI's president).

 

 

 

 

HDMI 2.1 is expected to be the revised hardware standard supporting additional forms of HDR (including, some day, HDR10 with dynamic metadata if it ever passes approval), and also things like HLG+High frame rates (it will take an HDR revision like this to pave the way for 4k HLG+120fps which is kind of seen as the future for broadcasting live events like sports...etc). Now can we PLEASE let this HDMI bullshit end with 2.1? Let us have it for five years at least. Ugh. 

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Despite LG being first with the conference later today, Panasonic have already got the party started and have lifted the lid on their next OLED TV, the EZ1002. Like its predecessor, I expect this to be seriously expensive (over £5000 again is my expectation). It's due for release around May.
 
panasonic_ez1000_with_inscreen_790.jpg

http://www.panasonic.com/uk/consumer/televisions/4KTV/tx-65ez1002b.html?cm_mmc=AffiliateDefault-_-Ecommerce-_-Default-_-Default&src=linkshare&siteID=TnL5HPStwNw-bmFD1n9Soy.4ViYDZ6krsA

 

 

From AV Forums:
 

The EZ1002 is the first HDR-capable Ultra HD 4K consumer OLED TV to support Panasonic's professional grade image processing and the TV’s 65-inch Master HDR OLED panel improves on the award-winning CZ952 in two key areas. Firstly, it can output around 800nits, which is double the peak brightness of that earlier model and secondly, it can deliver almost the full DCI colour space within Rec.2020, which is critical to producing a truly authentic High Dynamic Range (HDR) picture. Joining these two major advances in panel capability is an Absolute Black Filter that absorbs ambient light and reflections to further ensure that where part of an image should look black, it actually does look black. Panasonic additionally claim that the filter eliminates the magenta tone that affects other OLED screens in bright room conditions.

The EZ1002’s images are driven by the most powerful video processing Panasonic has ever built into a consumer television – the Studio Colour HCX2 processor. This includes ‘Delta Zero’ accuracy which means that thanks to 3D look-up tables (LUTs) similar to those used by Panasonic’s professional filmmaking and broadcast monitor division, the EZ1002 can deliver some of the most accurate colours found on a consumer television.

The HCX2 processor also tackles one of biggest OLED challenges: lost detail in near-black picture areas. One of OLED’s greatest strengths is its ability to create a wonderfully rich, deep black colour. However, to deliver such black colours OLED pixels are essentially switched off and switching them back on again requires quite a large physical change to go from one state to the other. Panasonic, though, is able to use knowledge acquired from its experience with plasma TVs to compensate for this characteristic of OLED panel technology, resulting in improved amounts of detail in even the darkest scenes.

Panasonic intends to continue its collaboration with renowned professional Hollywood colourist, Mike Sowa, to fine tune the EZ1002 before its launch in June and ensure that it accurately delivers the filmmakers’ original intentions. Thanks also to its Hollywood Lab, Panasonic has been able to draw on decades of experience working with Hollywood professionals when tuning the EZ1002’s HCX2 processing. This ensures that the TV delivers pictures that truly represent the vision of their creators.

Thanks to Panasonic’s long heritage in Hollywood, the EZ1002 even carries a number of semi-professional features. For instance, the EZ1002 allows professional users to upload their own colour 3D LUTs by SD/USB memory, if required. Also the OLED TV features Imaging Science Foundation (isf) calibration settings and compatibility with Portrait Display's CalMAN calibration software. These features will demonstrate to consumers that the EZ1002 offers a truly unique level of picture accuracy. AVForums saw a prototype of the EZ1002 back in early December and the manufacturer was comparing their new TV to a professional Sony OLED and the LG 65E6, with impressive results. The EZ1002 was delivering improved levels of detail in image areas just above black and was also producing a picture that was comparable to the Sony monitor.

 

More at the link:

 

https://www.avforums.com/article/panasonic-announce-the-65-ez1002-ez1000-ultra-hd-oled-tv.13237

 

 

There's no Dolby Vision, so we can confidently scratch Panasonic of the "maybe" list for DV supporters. Further into the AV Forums article they also note that Panasonic have NOT adopted Android, but instead appear to have kept working on Firefox OS since it is open source and turned it into something new. I'd expected to see that trickle down into their LED sets too in which case.  There's no 3D here either (rumour has it LG is ditching 3D too, although we'll know for sure in a matter of hours).

 

 

 

HDTV Test also have a write up:

 

http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/news/ez1000-201701044396.htm

 

 

Vincent conducted an interview too:

 


 

It doesn't sound like we'll get any LED/LCD updates from Panasonic until February. :( I'm very keen to hear about new 900 series updates. In Vincent's interview the fellow from Panasonic notes that, like last time, the US will not be getting this OLED and I'd imagine absence of their LED sets at CES would suggest the same. So weird that Panasonic have given up on the American TV market.

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We're starting to get a bit of info from the Samsung camp.
 
From HDTV Test:
 

In an attempt to differentiate, Samsung is branding the new LCD variant “QLED”, and there’s a lot to like about it. A further development of Quantum Dot technology, the company promises much improved brightness (quoted at between 1500 and 2000 cd/m2), superior coverage of the DCI-P3 colour space, superior colour volume performance (meaning that colour reproduction is maintained across all brightness levels), and critically, better off-axis viewing performance, which has long been a sore point of LED LCD displays – especially Samsung’s favoured PVA type. Samsung also promises improved contrast performance at the dark end of the scale, with superior black performance rounding off the claimed improvements. As usual, we won’t be able to verify the claims scientifically until we can measure the displays ourselves, but we were impressed by what we saw at tonight’s presentation.

For eagle-eyed enthusiasts (that is, our readers), the most interesting change will be one that the company did not explicitly draw attention to in its presentations: the new displays’ subpixel rendering techniques. When viewed up close, the majority of the images shown on the QLED LCD panels did not appear with the traditional RGB stripe layout, but instead were displayed with a cross-hatch pattern. It turns out that each pixel is split into two domains, which are then driven with different gamma properties. The end result is the improvements in off-axis viewing angle quality. Samsung refers to the technique as Dual Pixel Structure.

 

Samsung are not the first LCD manufacturer to use such a technique – long-time HDTVTest readers will likely be thinking of Sharp’s interesting LCD panels, and even Sony’s most recent displays have employed a more subtle variant. However, both the method and the results being demonstrated by Samsung’s new QLED displays appears far more pronounced. By this, we mean the different subpixel layout is more visible, but so too are the improvements to off-axis viewing. As with those similar methods from other manufacturers, full white areas of the screen in Samsung’s QLED implementation appear as RGB stripe, with the different pixel rendering technique becoming more visible in the darker and mid tones. (One of the first tests we’ll run when we receive review samples will be to feed a gradient ramp test pattern to the screens, to better observe the different rendering techniques used at different luminance levels.)

The new method is likely to divide opinion. Users who like to sit close to the screen will probably notice the cross-hatched effect more, and in one moving test clip, bright yellow New York style taxis moving quickly up the screen appeared with a diamond-like shimmer. On the other hand, users with larger and wider rooms may decide that the off-axis viewing improvements outweigh any other disadvantages the technique may or may not bring.


http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/news/qled-subpixel-201701044404.htm

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The Samsung sets come in three flavours this year, the Q7, Q8 and Q9. All three will have flat and curved options, including the Q9 which makes a change from 2016 where their flagship came exclusively as a curved display. The rumours were indeed true that they have abandoned full array local dimming at the top end, which will make it all the more interesting to see what the difference will be between the Q8 and Q9.

 

They genuinely seem to have improved the viewing angles from initial impressions. In fact initial impressions of the Q series in all respects from Forbes and others appears to be very good, though we will have to wait until after the press conference for more detailed reports. 

 

Here's a good first look though:

 

 

 

There's a brief AVS Forum summary as well:

http://www.avsforum.com/samsung-qled-q9-q8-and-q7-quantum-dot-tvs-announced-at-ces-2017/

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Not necessarily. The tech in the panel itself ultimately dictates how it responds to the method of lighting behind it. As I wrote some time back, if this is in fact a QDCF type panel (as rumours had been pointing towards for CES this year) then blooming and halo reduction could potentially be one of the benefits alongside wider colour gamut, higher brightness and better viewing angles. There's currently no firm knowledge as to whether this is a true implementation of QDCF or a variant of it, however. Press are not able to reveal the finer details of the panels until after the conference later today as presumably Samsung want to talk about the tech on stage first before completely lifting NDAs. 

 

My big hope for FALD will hopefully be with the successor for Panasonic's 900 series over here as they brought local dimming in at a very reasonable price, so if the model they hopefully announce in Feb retains that, along with similar processing as their next OLED, it should be one to keep an eye one for those of us on this side of the Atlantic.

 

I don't think Sony will do much with FALD this year. I expect their OLED will kill off a 65" successor to the Z series and in turn adopt last year's 65" Z price point, unless Sony want to keep a 65" Z out there as their premium HDR TV in 2017. At the very least I'd expect that they will keep Z series replacements for 75"+ TVs, but I don't expect to hear about Z series replacements today unfortunately as we're only half way into their annual lifecycle. I'd expect those to emerge again at IFA, so today we'll likely get an OLED tease, and 930d replacements.  

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Watching the LG conference right now.

 

They're talking 2017 OLED right now. Including support for HDR10, Dolby Vision, HLG and Technicolor HDR using their own algorithm to provide metadata when its not there in some cases. 

 

They also announced a 25% bump in brightness.

 

On the audio side, it looks like they are doing some form of Dolby Atmos processing on their 2017 OLED models as well.

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No 3D on LG OLED's in 2017 it seems.

 

https://www.cnet.com/products/lg-b7-series/preview/

 

 

 

All also offer Dolby Atmos sound, although ones with dedicated sound bars will likely sound better than those without. And despite the Atmos name and LG's claims of "full 360 sound," don't expect any TV to come close to matching a dedicated sound system's performance.

The rest of the differences relate to styling. Here's a rundown.

  • B7: crescent stand, "blade slim" look
  • C7: premium aluminum stand and bezel
  • E7: picture-on-glass design with integrated sound bar (similar to 2016 E6)
  • G7: picture-on-glass design with foldable integrated sound bar
  • W7: ultra-thin picture-on-wall design with separate sound bar

In 2016 there was a curved model, the C6, but this year every LG OLED has a flat screen, including the C7. And unlike last year, none of the 2017 OLED TVs, and indeed no LG TV period, supports 3D.

I almost regret not getting the C6 now....

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