Revolution Discussion Part III (Virtual Console, Controller, and Games)

[Angry the Clown]

Some news, not really Revolution related...

 

Gamespot is reporting the departure of Jim Merrick from Nintendo entirely, despite the fact he had recently left his post at Nintendo Europe to move back and work for Nintendo of America.

 

Just weeks after confirming that a three-year stint in Europe was coming to an end, it appears Jim Merrick, a marketing exec with an uncanny grasp of the technology behind the full range of Nintendo products, is leaving the company all together. "After nearly 12 years with Nintendo, the last three of which were at Nintendo of Europe, Jim Merrick has left the company to pursue other opportunities. We thank him for his many years of valuable service and wish him luck in his future endeavors," said a statement issued today by Nintendo reps. Merrick was one of the few Nintendo staffers who could be found participating in conferences or speaking candidly to reporters. He participated in the launch and sometimes development of almost all Nintendo products. Before joining Nintendo of America, Merrick was an independent consultant and contract programmer for numerous companies, including 4G Graphics, Vermont Microsystems, Texas Instruments, Computervision, and Compaq Computer. No mention of why Merrick and Nintendo parted ways was given.

 

I think this is quite a shame given how he could often be fairly outspoken about Nintendo’s future plans, particularly regarding the Revolution. He did a few good interviews with Eurogamer toward the end of 2005.

 

 

*******ADMIN NOTE*********

 

It's time to move forward with a new Revolution thread given the size of the last one. You can read the previous two threads here:

 

Revolution Thread Part I

 

Revolution thread Part II

 

Feel free to continue the discussion here.

[Romier S]

IGN has a first glimps of Nintendo's "Virtual Console" download service for NES, SNES, and N64 games. these are mock-ups so keep that in mind. You can take a look at the article here:

 

http://revolution.ign.com/articles/680/680846p1.html

 

Some snippets:

 

According to the enclosed mock-ups, once the "Virtual Console" option has been selected, Revolution owners are asked to choose a system for its corresponding games. NES, S-NES and N64 are the available options, which is appropriate since GameCube titles cannot be downloaded via this service; Revolution is able to play GCN software, but gamers must first own the original discs. Users seeking to download and play the classic Kid Icarus would obviously select the NES option, just as those hoping to get their hands on Pilot Wings 64 would go with the N64 icon.

 

Evidently the study highlighted three different pricing structures. The first was a subscription based package that would enable users to rent and play any game they wanted for $14.99 per month. Meanwhile, NES titles were listed for approximately $2.99 and N64 titles for a more expensive $19.99. These numbers are naturally neither finalized nor confirmed by Nintendo itself.

[The Daisy]

$14.99 a month? I could live with that, if I knew I could play any of the games anytime I wanted to.

 

Hopefully that list isn't final as I would need to have Mario Kart 64 on my list.

 

Glen

[Covak]

It only just occured to me how the Game Boy (Color) isn't getting any love with this Virtual Console thingy. I hope that changes.

[Rainmaykr]

I can't wait to see how this system is implemented.

 

I've always justified my ownership of ROMs with the idea that the games are no longer being produced, some publishers and developers are no longer in business and some titles can't be found in any other form. This puts a bit of a kink into that defense.

 

I would have liked to see a bit more creativity in the titles available. I KNOW this list is nowhere near official or final, but it's all we have to go with so I am.

 

Wouldn't it be wizard if Nintendo offered up some hidden gems that didn't get much attention back in the day. They could even do a monthly, limited time only run of some classics (a la Disney). For instance, Startropics can be purchased and downloaded during the month of July. Come August, Startropics is no longer available but Faxanadu will be.

 

Or, during the week of the release of the new Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles movie, you could download TMNT:The Arcade Game.

 

The possibilities are endless...

[Romier S]

Wouldn't it be wizard if Nintendo offered up some hidden gems that didn't get much attention back in the day. T

Sin and Punishment is on the N64 list in the article. They've already got my money there if that does indeed end up on the initial list of titles. One of the few Treasure developed titles I really enjoyed that I never got the chance to import.

[dogbert]

Sin and Punishment is on the N64 list in the article.

 

Which is why I don't place much faith in that list being at all accurate

[dogbert]

It only just occured to me how the Game Boy (Color) isn't getting any love with this Virtual Console thingy. I hope that changes.

 

I doubt Nintendo want to cannibalize sales of the GBA/DS as daft as that sounds.

[Covak]

I doubt Nintendo want to cannibalize sales of the GBA/DS as daft as that sounds.

 

I'm not talking about GBA or DS games, though. Or even whatever GBC games they're actually still selling. I'm thinking about original Game Boy games likes Metroid II and that Super Mario one (Super Mario Land, was it?).

 

The library seems rather incomplete without those games, if you ask me.

 

EDIT: Oh, you meant sales of GBA/DS hardware... well still, can't hurt to put out the games they aren't selling anymore.

[Romier S]

I'm not talking about GBA or DS games, though.

I think what Brian is saying is that the GBA is still able to play those games and it's a selling point for that system so having those games emulated on the Revolution would cannibalize sales of console (and he does note it's a daft way of thinking).

 

EDIT: You edited before I posted.

[ChrisBardon]

Count me in for being interested in Sin & punishment as well. I kept hearing about this game, but never got a chance to play it.

 

Another thing that would make this service amazing-downloadable trial versions (like on the Live Arcade). Might make people who can't remember a game (or who have never heard of a game) check out more interesting stuff.

 

For my part though, I don't think I'll be buying anything that I already own in cartridge form unless there's a significant reason to do so (online multiplayer, etc). Of course, I also still have working versions of all of the Nintendo consoles, which means ready access to any of my old games.

 

For some of the more obscure stuff though (like games I should never have sold), this will be great.

[Romier S]

I moved over the relevant posts from the previous Revolution thread so that we can continue discussing the Virtual Console and any new news that may come down the pipe for the Revolution gentleman.

[Camp]

I'm up for the 'pay a fee per game' pricing structure. I'm not interested in a subscription.

Even for mock-ups those screen shots are damn ugly. I know they don't want to give away the final interface but let's hope it doesn't share much of what we see in those shots.

[JFo]

For my part though, I don't think I'll be buying anything that I already own in cartridge form unless there's a significant reason to do so (online multiplayer, etc).

 

I would pay the money for these games just because I figure they would look much better playing through the Revolution than they would on the original systems. You probably wouldn't notice a difference on a standard TV, but anything that's not being fed into the TV through component video cables looks terrible in comparison to devices that do. The thought of playing Super Metroid or The Legend of Zelda: A Link to the Past in 480p resolution is just too delicious to pass up.

 

I'm up for the 'pay a fee per game' pricing structure. I'm not interested in a subscription.

 

Same here, although I might change my tune if Nintendo offered some sort of service that allowed you to play demos of upcoming games.

 

I would have liked to see a bit more creativity in the titles available. I KNOW this list is nowhere near official or final, but it's all we have to go with so I am.

 

Well, the titles on that list are all games that Nintendo published and therefore own the rights to. I fairly certain that if they wanted to get the Mega Man series playable on the Revolution, they'd have to clear it with Capcom first, especially if they were going to charge money for it.

 

Which leads me to wonder how many third-party games you'll see take advantage of this feature. I suppose it all depends on what Nintendo will charge these companies for licensing fees.

[merlot]

I'm really looking forward to the Revolution becasue of the controller and virtual console. The fact that they have Blast Corps on the N64 list is a huge plus. That game rocked and I always wished there'd be a followup title.

[Solitice]

Looks like we are going to see this baby before Thanksgiving

[GreenMonkey]

Well, I have a SNES & NES on tap, and enjoy collecting games for them.

 

That said, there are plenty of games I would like to try for just a couple of bucks. Shipping prices on ebay, or watching the EBgames morning update, gets old quick.

 

Still, I'm not big on paying for virtual downloads. NES games had better be cheaper than $3 IMO. I think $.99 downloads would be the sweetspot for Nintendo, just like it's the sweet spot for songs on iTunes (which I am also not the biggest fan of, admittedly). Maybe $1.99 tops. I mean, how much bandwidth does it really take for NES games that are like a few hundred k of data (tops!) And the 1-2 meg SNES games (on average)

 

SNES titles shouldn't be over $3-$4 IMO. And n64 titles should be under $7.

 

That said, I expect a boneheaded overpriced pricing structure from Nintendo. $3-$4 NES games. $5-$10 SNES and n64 games. If that happens, I'll just stick to scrounging games from used videogame stores and ebay. But at $.99 a pop you'd have even this game collector paying for a quick download (and 480p NES games, woot!).

 

The thing I would like to see most would be translated unreleased games. Terranigma (EUR). Dragon Quest 5 and 6. Tales. Etc. I hope the other game companies bite and get in on it.

[Rainmaykr]

The thing I would like to see most would be translated unreleased games. Terranigma (EUR). Dragon Quest 5 and 6. Tales. Etc. I hope the other game companies bite and get in on it.

If they did, you can forget about >$10 downloads, I would imagine. (Though, it would be worth it, ymmv)

[bendak]

Man, that interface is beyond fugly. I know its not final...but why even show that? :confused: Any 15 year old kid with a month of photoshop experience could do 10 times better. :barf

 

I think the system will launch at $249-$299.

 

I guess $2.99 seems fair for NES/SNES games... but $19.99 for N64 games? Yikes. I was thinking more like $9.99 tops.

[Angry the Clown]

"...and is aiming to launch the console in the US before Thanksgiving and before end of the year in Japan."

 

Ah Nintendo.... ever mysteriously skirting around that 'European' issue that seems to be clung to its heel like some godawful stain they wish they could remove. I'm importing a US Revolution regardless, but I do hope they push for a European launch in 2006 as well as I can't imagine the PS3 making it to European shelves this side of Christmas, and if the Revolution follows the PS3 in Europe I just can't imagine it being good for Nintendo's console (it's depressing enough seeing Cube bundles being sold for ?39 here, with almost every store removing anything Cube related from its inventory).

[Starhawk]

With that quote, can we assume the Revolution may possibly be the first Nintendo system to debut in America?

 

It sure points the proposed US date to sometime in November, with the Japanese launch probably in December and the European probably near the first of the year. (Considering Nintendo's statement to have a worldwide launch).

[Romier S]

Some more info from Reggie as he discusses pricing on the Revolution and more:

 

Reggie talks Revo

 

Q: We understand you have some New Year's resolutions for Nintendo. Let's start there.

Fils-Aime: Sure. From my perspective, I have five resolutions for the industry heading into 2006. The first is keeping our eyes on the prize. This industry is about entertainment, and in the end, he with the best games wins. So at Nintendo, we're focused on putting the most entertaining products into the marketplace.

 

The second resolution is keeping the mass in the mass audience. The world is fragmenting all around us, and many companies are making their products too exclusive and expensive for the general consumer.

 

For example, for American consumers to get into the Xbox 360 franchise, with games and extra contollers, they had to spend more than $700, not including an HD TV, which is really the only way to positively experience 360. We resolve at Nintendo to remain within reach for the vast majority of our consumers.

 

Since you mentioned pricing, I assume the Revolution will be accessible to gamers for substantially less than $700?

Fils-Aime: That's correct. The next-generation console from Nintendo, code-named Revolution, will cost less than $300. Our third resolution is to stop turning away new players.

 

This industry has become more and more focused on the niche, and at Nintendo, we've opened our systems to a wide range of consumers. Whether it's consumers older than 35 or female gamers, we've attracted them with "Nintendogs" and "Animal Crossing," so we've resolved to bring as many new consumers into this industry as possible.

 

How many launch titles will there be for the Revolution?

Fils-Aime: That question's a bit premature. We'll be showing a lot of titles at this year's E3, and we think that's where consumers will get a flavor for the full range of titles and the full range of activity that we will have for our launch window.

[ChrisBardon]

Just saw this article linked to from EvilAvatar http://megaman.retrofaction.com/index.php?subaction=showfull&id=1137696248&archive=&start_from=&ucat=2&

 

It talks about Mega Man on the next gen platforms, but what's interesting is this comment:

 

He also took the time to show me the "SNES 2006". Basically, it is the entire SNES crammed into a single chip that will be used in the Revolution. He said the N64 and NES chips were about the same size.

 

I suppose that this means that the back compatability will be done by including the original hardware in the rev, which can only be a good thing for compatability. I wonder what that does for the manufacturing cost?

 

Either way, a great sign that everything will actually work as planned. I wonder if that includes all of the add-on chips that they added to SNES carts (Super FX etc)?

[dogbert]

I call bullshit.

 

Now, I have some new information. I stopped by my local EB Games to pick up my copy of MMXC. When I walked in, the general manager was standing there with another individual. This person turned out to be a Nintendo rep, briefing the manager on the Nintendo Revolution.

He also took the time to show me the "SNES 2006". Basically, it is the entire SNES crammed into a single chip that will be used in the Revolution. He said the N64 and NES chips were about the same size.

 

So this Nintendo store rep - effectively a marketing peon pushing individual stores to push the current Ninty hot products in their store, ensure stores have marketing displays correct etc - carries around information on a new top secret chipset that has had zero information leak about it?

 

Just doesn't add up. In-store reps are notoriously clueless. I don't doubt this guy was a Ninty rep, I just don't trust him/her as a valid source of reliable information on the Revolution hardware.

[Camp]

Agreed. The Nintendo retail reps, while very nice people, are 100% clueless about new product news. They are just as surprised as the rest of us at news coming out at E3.

Their job is to inform retailers about proper return proceedures, putting up in-store P.O.P., and giving stores free Nintendo pens -they know nothing we don't already know.

 

Besides, why emulate these old systems in hardware when it can be done just as well (and at much less cost) in software?