Sony's Playstation 3 Discussion Part III (European delay and Launch shipment details)

[Josh]

No No i wasnt saying that at all. I meant with such a shortage after launch day, it opens up for more Wii (unless there are shortages which i doubt) and 360 sales this holiday season if people can not find a PS3.

 

I do not and will never understand this argument. It's used and abused in these mudslinging fanboy discussions. Have you ever gone to the store, after having waited for a product you really want, found out they didn't have it, and then bought something else that couldn't do the same thing? If someone wants a PS3 to play the next Metal Gear, Final Fantasy, God Of War, or whatever, he/she will wait for the PS3. He/she won't see the 360 or Wii sitting there and go, "Oh, well, this $500 I've saved up for 6 months could just be used on this 360 that doesn't have the games I want. Why not?"

 

It ... just ... doesn't ... happen. Please stop with the rhetoric. We're better than that here.

 

People who are waiting for the PS3 will wait for the PS3. Simple as that. Until the 360 and Wii can play those giant franchises PlayStation fans are waiting for, nothing will change.

 

The language in this thread is bizarre. It's as if we're sitting around strategizing how MS and N can "get in" on Sony's game. Boo-hoo'ing MS for not getting Halo 3 out earlier, because that would really do them in? Complaining that MS needs to get their AAA titles ready because they're losing the change to take down the big bad Kutagari? Silliness.

 

Please keep in mind that the Sony console will still sport some of the biggest and best franchises available. It's funny, really, reading recent threads about people who are finally getting PS2s, or held out on getting them, and are just now realizing what they missed out. It's mind-boggling, really.

 

If you really think MS and N are that much more in the right, that much more looking out for Joe Consumer, and that Sony really needs to go down, might I suggest a more satisfying vocation, perhaps Skeet Shooting? The skeet goes down right away. You even get a gun. No need to sit around waiting.

 

I understand you're having fun with this, but c'mon. Start another thread at this point. This one is polluted. Some of us (maybe just me, I don't know), actually plan on getting a PS3 and enjoying (what I consider, at least) the best non-shooter franchises available.

[Dimness]

That's ashame too as we shouldn't have to buy into such things. I'll continue to voice my opinion on the subject by saying that these consoles should come with an out of box 1 year warranty standard. I simply cannot understand the 90 day warranties that we continue to see with these devices.

 

Agreed, but I would also like to go on a side rant here. I'm getting sick and tired of Vendors not only pushing extended warranties on you, but basing some of their profit and revenue projections on them. For a long while there was a time when extended warranties only existed on appliances and vehicles. Now we're seeing them on video games? Riverboat gambling is more honest than these warranties. At least you get a payoff instead of piss poor excuses not to fix your product. Well actually that's another issue, but it's hard to seperate the two when talking about extended warranties.

 

BTW, my original PS2 failed to read discs a year ago. And so far playing Oblivion for hours on end has not hurt my 360 yet.

[Romier S]

BTW, my original PS2 failed to read discs a year ago. And so far playing Oblivion for hours on end has not hurt my 360 yet.

Which you of course realize doesn't mean much as many here have had PS2's for years and have gone through 3 Xbox 360's in less than 6 months.

[Josh]

Which you of course realize doesn't mean much as many here have had PS2's for years and have gone through 3 Xbox 360's in less than 6 months.

 

Funny you mention that; I have a launch PS2 that's working great - played the Okami demo the night before I left (I'm in CA right now).

 

Annie called me this morning to let me know that our 360 (that we bought in March) is "doing something weird with the lights turning red."

 

She was only playing Galaga, too. Meh. At least I bought the BestBuy guarantee.

[EnemaEms]

From the sounds of how the FF series is going....no one will get to play it.

 

Where people will buy other systems are parents....parents buy kids consoles for X-mas. Regular fanboys...I mean...people like this forum will get their PS3's regardless if it is on launch or the 2nd or 3rd batch.

 

I agree partially with your post Josh...except that MS and the Big N (especially the Big N) have some great franchises that are not shooters.

 

-Dean-

[Carlucci]

I do not and will never understand this argument. It's used and abused in these mudslinging fanboy discussions. Have you ever gone to the store, after having waited for a product you really want, found out they didn't have it, and then bought something else that couldn't do the same thing? If someone wants a PS3 to play the next Metal Gear, Final Fantasy, God Of War, or whatever, he/she will wait for the PS3. He/she won't see the 360 or Wii sitting there and go, "Oh, well, this $500 I've saved up for 6 months could just be used on this 360 that doesn't have the games I want. Why not?"

 

It ... just ... doesn't ... happen. Please stop with the rhetoric. We're better than that here.

 

People who are waiting for the PS3 will wait for the PS3. Simple as that. Until the 360 and Wii can play those giant franchises PlayStation fans are waiting for, nothing will change.

 

 

Hold on there, [non] workout boy! You've got the blinders of a hardened gamer on. What about Mommy Mcfee, who just wants to get junior a present for CHRISTmas. Faced with the loss of a sale during holiday season, you think Billy McClerk is not going to do everything in his power to convince mommy to walk out with the Wii or 360 instead? You think his manager is going to be fine with McClerk saying "Yeah, I'd wait for the Ps3. Keep checkin' back."

 

I don't think so. Anyone who walked into a BB during the great 360 famine knows the insane things the employees will say to get you to buy periphals and games even though the hardware was nowhere to be seen. I can easily seeing incentive programs for bird-in-the-hand sales tactics.

 

And therefore Joey's argument that a shortage of PS3's will lead to an increase in holiday sales of the Wii60 are perfectly valid, IMO.

 

 

Carlos.

[Josh]

I agree partially with your post Josh...except that MS and the Big N (especially the Big N) have some great franchises that are not shooters.

 

As for N, I totally agree. I'm having a hard time thinking of a major exclusive 360 franchise that isn't a shooter / tactical military thing with guns (or racer). And by major, I mean something that has market pull. And shooter fans: don't get your panties in a bunch. I have no problem with shooters, and I understand and encourage the need to kill 12 year-olds on Live.

 

As for parents buying consoles, it's my opinion that these are the people that trust the PlayStation brand the most since it's what they've had for the past 10 years. If anything, they're the biggest fanboys of all. The parents I know buy nothing other than PlayStations for their kids. They just don't consider anything else.

[Josh]

Hold on there, [non] workout boy! You've got the blinders of a hardened gamer on. What about Mommy Mcfee, who just wants to get junior a present for CHRISTmas. Faced with the loss of a sale during holiday season, you think Billy McClerk is not going to do everything in his power to convince mommy to walk out with the Wii or 360 instead? You think his manager is going to be fine with McClerk saying "Yeah, I'd wait for the Ps3. Keep checkin' back."

 

I absolutely disagree. If Baby McSpoiled wants a PS3 and only a PS3, Mommy McChristian is going to get Baby McSpoiled nothing else.

 

Try giving a girl an American Girl knockoff. She'll never talk to you again.

 

Oh... and as for the workout - I'm in California with family. I went running this morning along Seal Beach. So bite me.

[Bassmasa]

It ... just ... doesn't ... happen. Please stop with the rhetoric. We're better than that here.

 

I totally disagree. This argument is certainly NOT fanboy rhetoric, regardless of how often it actually happens. I think it's quite possible that someone wants a next gen console, sees the shortage of PS3s, assumes will be months before ample supply is available, then chooses the 360 on the shelf in order to play Madden right now. Not to mention parents that will get whatever they can for their kids for Christmas.

 

Those of us, and like us, that want a PS3 will be unaffected, but Joe consumer will at least give some consideration to the idea. Now, people saying Sony has lost the race are ridiculous, but it's certainly a giant hole to start in. If this wasn't the case, why not just push the entire launch back to 2007? Why did Katugra apologize? It's a huge issue without question.

 

With so many games going multi-platform, especially between the PS3 and 360, the line gets grayer as to which one to own. This is why I said during E3 that GTA on 360 at launch is huuuuuuuuge. I don't know how many PS2's GTA sold, but there will be PLENTY of gamers that think, "I can get GTA on the 360 the same day as PS3, I'll get the 360 now instead of a PS3 in a few months." (By "gamers", I mean the bread and butter casual folks that bought the PS2 in droves, buying games like Madden, GTA, and other 500k titles with little else).

[Union Carbine]

I do not and will never understand this argument. It's used and abused in these mudslinging fanboy discussions. Have you ever gone to the store, after having waited for a product you really want, found out they didn't have it, and then bought something else that couldn't do the same thing? If someone wants a PS3 to play the next Metal Gear, Final Fantasy, God Of War, or whatever, he/she will wait for the PS3. He/she won't see the 360 or Wii sitting there and go, "Oh, well, this $500 I've saved up for 6 months could just be used on this 360 that doesn't have the games I want. Why not?"

 

It ... just ... doesn't ... happen...

Except that many times it isn't the individual buying for themselves but, particularly in the case of Xmas, buying for someone else. How many people growing up got Intellivisions for Xmas because the local electronics store was out of Ataris? If I have to buy a present for my son / daughter / whatever, I'd rather have something in hand than nothing. The core gamer, I'm sure will wait for what they absolutely want, but many other people who are looking for the hot system for a gift will take whatever they can get.

 

We've all had the experience, I'm sure, of getting a gift that wasn't exactly what we wanted. Myself, one year I looked in horror upon a freshly unwrapped Gobot toy when I desperately wanted a Transformer. My mom couldn't tell the difference. I'm sure many other non-hardcore types feel the same way about the 360/PS3/Wii, although the Wii, seems uniquely positioned to differentiate itself in this regard.

[Josh]

totally disagree. This argument is certainly NOT fanboy rhetoric, regardless of how often it actually happens. I think it's quite possible that someone wants a next gen console, sees the shortage of PS3s, assumes will be months before ample supply is available, then chooses the 360 on the shelf in order to play Madden right now. Not to mention parents that will get whatever they can for their kids for Christmas.

 

You missed the exact point of my argument. Madden is Madden. Final Fantasy, God Of War, Metal Gear, etc. are not Madden.

 

Again, those who are waiting for a PS3 will wait for a PS3. If they want Madden now, well, they can have it now.

[Solitice]

Personally I think spending 600+ on a xmas present is absolutely insane...Maybe if you have 4 kids or something and split it up between them. Tell the truth I'm going to have a difficult time justifying that price range to my wife for myself and this is coming from a guy that had a "freak" 5 digit size collection not that long ago. So with that said I think that the price difference between the Wii and the PS3 will shift more parents than the availability IMO.

 

I don't think anyone here really wants any of the 3 to fail Stencil. Its just fun to put on the marketing annalist hat and predict what is going to happen. Its not like we get a prize or something if we're right.

 

Dean

[foogledricks]

Madden is Madden. Final Fantasy, God Of War, Metal Gear, etc. are not Madden.

You're talking about people who are getting a PS3 no matter what. Those people need not be debated here. People here are talking about fence-sitters. Those people may in fact be affected by the timing of their desires and the availability of their options.

[EnemaEms]

As for N, I totally agree. I'm having a hard time thinking of a major exclusive 360 franchise that isn't a shooter / tactical military thing with guns (or racer). And by major, I mean something that has market pull. And shooter fans: don't get your panties in a bunch. I have no problem with shooters, and I understand and encourage the need to kill 12 year-olds on Live.

Now you throw racers in the bunch...I see how you are.

 

-Dean-

[Rainmaykr]

I do not and will never understand this argument. It's used and abused in these mudslinging fanboy discussions. Have you ever gone to the store, after having waited for a product you really want, found out they didn't have it, and then bought something else that couldn't do the same thing?

Though I doubt I'm the norm, on Xbox launch day I went to the store (rumour was Target had a few on the shelves) but didn't find anything except PS2s. I was in the mood for some console lovin' so I picked up a PS2 instead. I picked up an Xbox a few weeks later, but the point is after much hype and waiting, I was ready to get SOMETHING, anything video games and I wasn't coming back from the store empty handed.

[Rainmaykr]

Which you of course realize doesn't mean much as many here have had PS2's for years and have gone through 3 Xbox 360's in less than 6 months.

Blah, I own 2 Xboxes, v1.0 boards, and neither have given me an ounce of problem, and one of my v1.0 boards has even been the guinea pig for my OJT modding binge.

 

In fact, I've NEVER had a system go out on me. Even my Sega CD still reads discs fine. (The locking up of some FMV sequences in Sewer Shark are "working as intended." )

 

If you've gone through 3 360s in 6 months you are not allowed to borrow any of my stuff until you learn to take care of your own shit.

[PoisonJam]

I also wouldn't discount the impact of kids hedging their bets when making out their Xmas lists and listing both the PS3 and the 360. That's what my nephew does...asks for one of everything, hoping to get one of something. And if there are 50 360s in stock and zero PS3s...

 

As others mentioned, though, even those kids who specifically ask for a PS3 may find themselves with a 360 instead because it was available. As a parent shopping for your kids, if you are faced with getting them a 360 now, or a slip of paper saying "Good for one PS3 whenever they come in stock", which would you choose? As a kid, which would you rather open?

 

I think the issue of stock availability affecting sales to the extent of swinging potential PS3 sales towards the 360 is very real this holiday season; not rhetoric at all.

[Dave C]

I think the issue of stock availability affecting sales to the extent of swinging potential PS3 sales towards the 360 is very real this holiday season; not rhetoric at all.

 

This will happen with out a doubt. Sony may also continue to out sell the 360 with the PS2.

[Romier S]

If you've gone through 3 360s in 6 months you are not allowed to borrow any of my stuff until you learn to take care of your own shit.

Nice generalization. It means little to those that have taken care of thier consoles and still have had to deal with continued product issues through no fault of thier own. Great example:

 

http://www.lcvg.com/forum/showpost.php?p=190968&postcount=137

 

http://www.lcvg.com/forum/showpost.php?p=191040&postcount=149

 

It's cool that you've had great experiences with the consoles you've owned in the past Rain. I've only ever had one Xbox go out on me out of all of the consoles I've owned which I'm quite happy about. That doesn't excuse poor failure rate and technical issues nor does it automatically mean people are treating thier consoles like crap either. That isn't a bash against Microsoft mind, it's just the situation folks find themselves in and I think it's obvious that you're own personal experience has zero bearing whether you happen to get a defective product or not. Which was the original point.

[Rainmaykr]

Nice generalization.

Meh, I don't let people borrow my shit anyway, I was just using it as an excuse to say shit. (Besides, how do you KNOW these people aren't really hamfisted when handling their loot?)

 

Though, I would be interested to see some empirical info showing that the failure rate of these consoles is out of the norm for electronics of this complexity.

[kelley]

PlayStation 3 box art design. They are to come in the standard Blu-Ray case.

 

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[Bassmasa]

Wow, I really like the IGN logo on the chic's left hoot.

[PrivatePixel]

I like the box art template: very clean aesthetics, and the use of left-aligned text is not only reminiscent of the software packaging from the original PlayStation, it places better visual emphasis on the artwork.

 

I don't think the current Blu-ray keepcase will be used, as it's too thin to house a booklet (especially the ones included by RPG developers).

[General Zot]

I also wouldn't discount the impact of kids hedging their bets when making out their Xmas lists and listing both the PS3 and the 360. That's what my nephew does...asks for one of everything, hoping to get one of something. And if there are 50 360s in stock and zero PS3s...

 

As others mentioned, though, even those kids who specifically ask for a PS3 may find themselves with a 360 instead because it was available. As a parent shopping for your kids, if you are faced with getting them a 360 now, or a slip of paper saying "Good for one PS3 whenever they come in stock", which would you choose? As a kid, which would you rather open?

 

I think the issue of stock availability affecting sales to the extent of swinging potential PS3 sales towards the 360 is very real this holiday season; not rhetoric at all.

 

 

I'll second that sentiment. For some kids only two chances exist all year to get a new console: birthday present or xmas present. So if there are no PS3s (choice #1 on list), then it is likely either a 360 or a Wii (choices #2-3) or no console at all. A kid might LOVE FF and MGS, but if it is Halo or nothing for a year, he'll likely be happier than a pig in slop with a 360.

 

Even more painful, I agree 100% with Keith on this. We're discussing fence sitters and clueless grandparent purchases here, not dyed in the wool Sony fans. Everyone on this forum likely had their priorities staked out last year, Joe Sixpack might not even have a preference standing in line at BB to buy the console in his hands.

[kelley]

I don't think the current Blu-ray keepcase will be used, as it's too thin to house a booklet (especially the ones included by RPG developers).

 

One thing you have to remember here, Sony wants you to know that you bought a Blu-Ray Disc not just a PS3 game. Blu-Ray, Blu-Ray, Blu-Ray...that is why North America is getting 400,000 units at launch.